Has Ambre Loup been diluted and reformulated? The answer might be Yes. There are a few reasons why that could be the case, and I’ll go over them in this post.
Ambre Loup was released in 2012 with very different packaging, label text positioning and colour, cap colour, and alcohol percentage than what they are now. Back then, it came in a 50 ml size (and only in a 50 ml size); its black label had “Ambre Loup” written on top with “Rania J.” written below in silver-grey; the silver-grey box had 80% alcohol written on the side panel; and the cap was silver with no engravings or markings on it. Most of the following photos are from old listings on eBay, though the cap and bottle ones are mine:
Original Rania J. Ambre Loup bottle and box
80% alcohol volume written on the side panel for the original silver box of Ambre Loup.
Ambre Loup original bottle, label and cap. Observe: the silver, unengraved cap; the label with “Ambre Loup” as the first text and written in white; and the position of the grey “Rania J.” near the bottom. Photo: my own.
The sticker label on the base of my Ambre Loup bottle, batch #13987. Photo: my own.
Now let’s take a look at the current packaging which, I think, was released in 2019. Observe the differences in: box colour, label text positions and colours, and cap colour and engraving. I have been unable to find a photo online of the black box’s side panel showing the alcohol volume percentage but, by many accounts, it now reads as “83% volume.”
Current Rania J. Ambre Loup 50 ml black box.
Current Ambre Loup with a black cap that has engraved RJ initials in silver and also has “Rania J.” as the first words on the label.
Current Ambre Loup with its cap in black and “Rania J.” as the first words on the label. The text positions have all been altered.
Let me add that the packaging changes seem to have occurred at the same time as Rania J. launching a 100 ml version of Ambre Loup. For years, all that was previously available was a 50 ml bottle.
On Fragrantica, as you will see below, several people have noted that current Ambre Loup has an 83% alcohol volume written on the box, not 80%, and I need to explain the meaning of that because it’s significant. The alcohol level relates to the percentage of fragrance oils in the composition. The more alcohol in a scent, the less overall fragrance materials there are. So, for example, a fragrance with 80% alcohol volume has 20% fragrance, putting it at or almost at extrait concentration. In contrast, a fragrance with a higher 83% alcohol volume has a lower level of 17% of actual scent which makes it an eau de parfum, not a parfum.
For the record, Rania J. said as recently as this year that Ambre Loup has not been reformulated. I was informed of that by a Twitter follower who bought a bottle and asked the store if the scent had been changed.
The earliest comment on Fragrantica about alleged Ambre Loup reformulation or differerences was in 2019, followed by two more in 2020:
Pb07 on 09/23/19:
This has been reformulated?
Newer one DOSENT project at all.. Earlier one has great depth but newer ones are not so complex. Earlier it was 80% volume newer ones are 83% volumeIf you can get earlier version then it is worth.. Newer are just MEH!
Brigante21 on 03/04/21:
Pb07 is right, it has been reformulated. A friend has a new bottle and I noticed straight away that it was less potent than my bottle. Sure enough new one lists alcohol at 83%, original is 80%.Now don’t get me wrong, it still smells great but it doesn’t knock your socks off in quite the same way. If you’ve never experienced the original then disregard this review and just enjoy it for what it is
Dingleberries on 12/31/20:
In 2013 I had a bottle and it was wonderful very nuclear performance. I just treated myself to a new bottle purchased from LuckyScent (Batch# 20.0766) and it’s lasting about 1-2 hours on skin IF THAT! it is very weak in performance, sillage & longevity. I’m very upset not even at the fact that I wasted $260 but that this once beautiful fragrance has been destroyed by time! Rania J I’m very disappointed in you I thought we were friends!
Apart from the alleged changes in fragrance concentration, longevity and sillage, it sounds to me as though there might also have been changes in Ambre Loup’s focal point. To be specific, many descriptions now talk about Ambre Loup as a vanilla-heavy fragrance, something which it wasn’t really before. Returning to Fragrantica, note the “monotonous vanilla” in this November 2020 description of Ambre Loup:
Narciso70 on 11/12/20:
For me It is not a special perfume as they say, in fact it has probably been reformulated because it also has a poor persistence and sillage.The scent opens well: spicy amber but it’s only a moment.
After 10 minutes there remains a too monotonous vanilla on the skin, no amber is not at all special but to see the youtubers it would seem. Nothing animalic…oud? 🙂
Vanilla is, in fact, how and why my investigation into possible changes to Ambre Loup began. Either in late 2021 or early 2022, I strongly recommended Ambre Loup to a dear close friend, the famous beauty blogger Temptalia, when she sought recommendations on the best amber fragrances on the market. She enjoys fragrances with good sillage and longevity in the vein of Tom Ford‘s original version of Amber Absolute, so I shared my 2015 review of Ambre Loup and told her about the fragrance’s dark, sexy, smoky labdanum with its hashish-like spiciness, resinous leatheriness, and quasi-animalic oud muskiness.
Not once did I mention “vanilla” because vanilla is simply not something that comes to mind when I think of my beloved fragrance. Not once, not ever. Yes, there definitely is vanilla in the fragrance, but it is hardly a significant feature. It’s simply one of the tertiary things in the base.
So imagine my confusion and surprise at hearing that, on Temptalia, Ambre Loup was primarily a smoky vanilla fragrance with terribly weak sillage and terrible longevity. Though I can no longer recall the exact numbers she shared with me, I think Ambre Loup lasted only 4 or 5 hours on her. Ambre Loup! The fragrance that lasted so long on me in 2015 that it initially turned me off of the scent until the bouquet’s addictive magic made me fall wildly in love. I couldn’t fathom what I was hearing from my friend, so I suggested that she re-test with double the quantity. The result was the same. So she tested it on her husband and, while it was a darker scent on him with a sliver of resinous leatheriness, it still had loads of vanilla right from the start amidst the labdanum amber.
These scent profiles were so inapposite to my own experiences that she looked into the matter further; and it was she who alerted me to the Fragrantica comments regarding Ambre Loup’s poor performance and the alcohol volume change.
Then, roughly two weeks ago, someone commenting here put Les Indémodables Vanille Havane in the same category as Ambre Loup or equated them as similar. I blinked. I couldn’t understand how a vanilla tobacco fragrance could compare.
I tested Vanille Havana the other day. I can see why someone might find a few note parallels to Ambre Loup, particularly in terms of the resinous amber and smokiness. That said, my 2015 (?) bottle of Ambre Loup is ultimately so different in character, essence, central driving note focuses, and drydowns that I became even more convinced that something had happened to Ambre Loup.
Now, suddenly, other comments that people have made to me about Ambre Loup since 2020 are also making sense. Different Twitter followers have told me that: Ambre Loup has given them a headache; Ambre Loup didn’t last long on them; Ambre Loup had low sillage on them; and Ambre Loup had no perceptible or real oud.
Let me talk about the headache issue, because that was one more thing that made me suspicious about a possible Ambre Loup reformulation. As most of you know, I have an intense and very physical response to woody-amber or smoky aromachemicals. They give me a migraine at the very least. I would not and could not wear Ambre Loup if it had strong woody-amber synths. So when someone who says that they have far less sensitivity to aromachemicals than I tells me, circa 2020 or 2021, that Ambre Loup gave them a migraine, I did a double-take.
So what is the significance or point of all this? Does it change whether Ambre Loup is an enjoyable scent?
No, I’m not saying that the fragrance is now “bad.” I haven’t tried it to know.
But I think it’s important to alert you to the possibility that the Ambre Loup that I raved about – for years as one of my top personal favourites, that I put on one of my Best Of annual lists, and that was once compared by both me and others to Areej Le Doré‘s superb, limited-edition Russian Oud, an resinous, somewhat animalic, musky, oud-amber which has little in common with vanilla-centric fragrance like Vanille Havane – that Ambre Loup may no longer exist in terms of focal point, note emphasis, sillage, longevity, and/or concentration strength. I mean, my god, Ambre Loup is not meant to be a vanilla-amber or even a vanilla-heavy scent!
Again, Rania J. claims that she hasn’t changed Ambre Loup. In light of that, everything here is mere speculation, though the 80% vs 83% alcohol difference raised my eyebrows sharply. How can a fragrance with less fragrance oils and more alcohol possibly be identical to one with different numbers?
If you want to try Ambre Loup with the dark, addictive, dense, powerful, musky oud, smoky, leathery, and heavily spiced labdanum magic that stole my heart, then I’d suggest looking for bottles with a silver cap, a label that reads “Ambre Loup” written in white at the top, and a silver box that has an 80% alcohol volume number.
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Yikes! It’s a shame for them to ruin Ambre Loup. I bought my bottle somewhere around 2015 (another lifetime), batch code L: 15892. The bottle and box look like those in the eBay picture, only my bottle has a raised plastic label rather than a paper one. It’s 83% alcohol, and on me this is a rich smoky powerhouse of longevity with just one spray. It’s my most potent amber. I don’t get vanilla up front at all. Maybe there was an initial dilution, and then further reformulation along the way?
Yes, this is exactly how my 2015 (2014?) bottle is on me, too!
Fascinating about the in-between formulation that you and Shiva Woman have experienced. Yet, still a huge powerhouse in terms of longevity. God bless the old Silver Cap Version!
Yes, I will cherish my bottle.
Thank god I took your advice and bought Ambre Loup blind-sniffed and just loved it years ago (it took me a few tries when they had it in stock). I have the old bottle. There are a very few perfumes that you describe, and even though you don’t like them, I sometimes do, and, based on your descriptions test/buy. But there has never been a perfume that you liked or loved–that I didn’t passionately adore. That’s why I have my bottle of Russian Oud and Oud Picante nestled safely in their beds! I’m so sorry to hear this news. It’s not like Ambre Loup is going to pick up new followers or a fan club with a vanilla-esque perfume because that’s so unique….
just correct the above to shiva-woman
I’ve learnt about reformulations from your past Chypre Palatin and Alahine reviews so its definitely something I am conscious about whenever sampling. For me current Ambre Loup has the same potency as Chanel’s Le Lion so its now a midweight amber to me. It does last a long time on my skin but most of that is a skin scent. However that could also be my own skin issue based on my track record haha! The last ‘silver’ bottle that I bought does seem less animalic then my first silver bottle (I had two in total, don’t remember the year of purchase).
My understanding so far is that synthetic amber and/or woody amber helps with increased longevity and sustain projection? I did honestly wonder if something was also subtracted to the recipe. There were some other reformulations which I thought loss their legs but smelt more ‘natural’ and less ‘crispy’. Its interesting to know what the case is.
Vanille Havane definitely has alot of woody amber. I sprayed a strip and left it in my kitchen and it permeated my entire studio apartment (when I was staying in Canada). But yeah, I still like it though I don’t know if I can put up with that much projection in the tropics (where I am now). For that matter, a drop of vintage Jean Patou 1000 also filled up my entire room. I’ve always assumed naturals can’t extend that far and it was mostly synthetic muscle.
Speaking about Rania, I definitely miss both my bottles of Lavande 44 and Jasmin Kama. Its a pity that she can’t ship to where I am now. I believe the new bottles smell almost identical to the older ones so it might just be Ambre Loup that could be different.
Oh, in my experience and on my skin, orientals definitely explode in humid, tropical weather, so I expect Vanille Havane would be HUGE where you are now.
As for the synths in Ambre Loup, you’re right that woody-ambers typically increase longevity and sillage. I haven’t tried current Ambre Loup to know what’s in the base and the gentleman who spoke to me about his migraine did not elaborate with any olfactory specifics. So I don’t know what specific note or smell was the trigger.
I think I just assumed that it might have been a woody-amber given how they’re usually the most forceful things around, that’s what triggers me, and also woods and amber are notes in Am re Loup.
I will say that there are synthetic mixed fragrances with moderate to low longevity on me, like a few Jovoys or Diors.
With regard to Ambre Loup, there’s no way we can know with absolute certainty unless Rania J. tells and she’s claimed as recently as this year that Ambre Loup has NOT been reformulated. Hm. Take that how you will.
Okay, I’m back after thoroughly inspecting my bottle. I think I agree with Holly. My bottle looks exactly like yours Kafakaesque. It’s the very top picture and top cap, no engraving. But it’s not a paper label. It’s kind of a funky plasticky label glued on like a cheap leather (what Holly has). The box is silver. And the perfume is at the top followed by name, so everything else “looks” like yours K. But…when I check the box I see “83% Volume.” I purchased mine probably around 2017-18. I have never been struck by its oudish or beast-mode qualities (but I’m a hardened soul). But that perhaps suggests that there have been a few reformulations. I think Holly and I may have the “inbetweens.” Interestingly, the “batch” code on mine is: 15.892 (yes there’s a decimal). So I definitely avoided the super-new reformulation, but there was a reformulation with mine at 83%. (Edit: I just sprayed, and yeah, tobacco, vanilla and to me a hefty oud (with animalic)–but there is vanilla and tobacco in it…). I very much like it, but I would not call this an amber exactly). I happen to love tobacco and rum fragrances and this skews more like that on me now. The oud-like note is very present, however. It’s not TF Tobacco Vanille. But yeah… vanilla. There is vanilla.
Excellent detective skills and investigatory findings, my dear. Thank you!
Just checked my bottle again. There is a decimal on the bottle, 15.892, not the box. So it appears we have the same batch code. I agree we may have an “inbetween” version. I just sprayed too out of curiosity, to see if the warmer weather might bring out vanilla. Not on me, at least.
There’s a 50ml silver cap on EBay right now for $150 from Estonia.
What seems to be key, after reading a few other comments here by old Ambre Loup owners, is the alcohol volume % number on the box. If a seller doesn’t show that in their photos, I’d suggest that anyone interested ask the seller for a photo of the % number.
One seller on eBay has the 100ml listed as “rare niche.”
I saw that, lol.
OK, 2 1/2 hours later, and 18 boxes later with only 4 to go, I found Amber Loup.
Of course it was in the box labled By Kilian Niche Misc. Go figure.
Silver box with black label and everything is excatly like yours, except the batch code
is on the left side under Acohol Dent. Batch code 13987. 50 ml 80% Vol.
It’s unopened. I had a bunch of samples of Ambre Loup that I used.
Speaking of samples. I found a Danger Exlir of Roja’s in one of my Xerjoff boxes.
It’s from Osswalds and it’s still halfway full. It must be from 2016.
I have no idea what it was doing in there, but I know what I’ll be spraying on tomorrow.
Also I found out that my Fredrick Malle’s Musc Ravaguer is from 2012.
I also found out that my Royal Water has only 3 ingredients on the label. Very cool.
I had a blast looking through my collection.
I haven’t been through the boxes in awhile.
I’m glad I worked hard and purchased what I did when I did, and I would like to thank you
for your blog kafkaesque.You’ve provided meaningful insight to our perfume community. It means a lot to us frag heads.
Been getting into vintage perfumes for the last severly months.
Wearing a vintage Lagerfeld Cologne right now.
I like it.
I know you’re not into YouTube to much, and with a degree, rightly so.
There is a reviewer named Ramsey who is really into vintage
He’s not into the whole Gotta Get Those Views up mentallity.
He just loves perfume. That’s all.
Worth checking out.
OK, gotta put these boxes back.
Thank you again for all you do.
eddie.
ps, sorry about the spelling.
Same batch code as mine, Eddie! Hurray for finding it. I’m so glad.
Even more pleased to hear you’re wearing vtg Lagerfeld. Maybe that should be my SOTN.
Thank you for the kind words on my site. *hug*
This is the reply I got from Rania:
Today we contacted Rania and this is her reaction:
Hi
I am fine and hope you are doing fine too…
I read the client message.
Let me explain what is the story behind 83% and 80%.
At the beginning, as Ambre is very thick we had some difficulties to dilute it, so we used 83% alcohol
At then, we were able to dilute it with 80% alcohol.
So first, i had the packaging with 83% and then we printed the packaging with 80% when we were able dilute the perfume with 80% of Alcohol.
The % of the alcohol has nothing to do with the fragrance.It is a production process only.
All the new productions are with 80% alcohol.
The perfumes with black caps (new packaging) have 80% alcohol.
The perfume is the same and will never change.
Take care
Best regards
Rania
Thank you, Mr. Houchen, for contacting her. I greatly appreciate it. I am currently out of the office but I will post her reply verbatim as soon as I can.
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